Help with using Combine and Union on a Bezier Curve and Shape

funkpod · Postby **funkpod** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 6:02 am

Hello, trying to combine this set of text, shape (rectangle), and bezier curve heart.

here is the link to both photos.

https://goo.gl/photos/taR7kYv72vg3tpeU7

https://goo.gl/photos/MwiTN69DdLNXfBpS6

In the first photo, you can see that I have drawn a heart w/ bezier curve tools, text w/ text tool, and rectangle w/ rectangle tools.

I want to use COMBINE and then UNION, so that all i see is one solid object, heart, text, rectangle, w/ the cutouts around the text and stuff.

HOWEVER, when I use the union tool, this happens...

https://goo.gl/photos/wdPCHJXXhTMwvzTn7
What is happening?

This is eventually going to be cut out using a laser cutter, so I am going to transfer this to a .dxf file. I can make the drawing look fine, but it is different w/ lasers cutting things out.

Any ideas? THANK YOU!

Espermaschine · Postby **Espermaschine** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:10 am

Text must be a path and ungrouped.
Also you have to convert strokes into paths.
Then Union works.

I would do it like this:
-perform Union on text (quicker than 'text to path', 'ungroup', 'combine')
-select all objects,
-convert strokes to path,
-Union

Moini · Postby **Moini** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:11 am

I've also fallen into this trap already... Thought it was a bug, but it isn't.

For the Path -> Union operation, two things are relevant:
- Path direction
- Path fill rule

(see a table here: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/23294832 ... n_0.91.svg )

So you can do this:
- Do the conversion to path, as Espermaschine suggested, for all objects.
(I'm not sure if you want 'stroke to path' - I think that result would be difficult to cut out with the tiny lines.)
- Don't union them all at once, but step-wise
- If in one step, you don't get the result you want, play with the path direction (Path -> Reverse) and the fill rule (the heart-shaped buttons in the top right of the Fill&Stroke dialog, first tab), then try again until it looks correct.

funkpod · Postby **funkpod** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:15 am

Espermaschine wrote:Text must be a path and ungrouped.
Also you have to convert strokes into paths.
Then Union works.

I would do it like this:
-perform Union on text (quicker than 'text to path', 'ungroup', 'combine')
-select all objects,
-convert strokes to path,
-Union

The problem is that the text Unions fine, but the heart doesn't. This will get it work? But I will convert the strokes into paths. I'll try that, thanks.

funkpod · Postby **funkpod** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:18 am

Moini wrote:I've also fallen into this trap already... Thought it was a bug, but it isn't.

For the Path -> Union operation, two things are relevant:
- Path direction
- Path fill rule

(see a table here: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/23294832 ... n_0.91.svg )

So you can do this:
- Do the conversion to path, as Espermaschine suggested, for all objects.
(I'm not sure if you want 'stroke to path' - I think that result would be difficult to cut out with the tiny lines.)
- Don't union them all at once, but step-wise
- If in one step, you don't get the result you want, play with the path direction (Path -> Reverse) and the fill rule (the heart-shaped buttons in the top right of the Fill&Stroke dialog, first tab), then try again until it looks correct.

I'll try this. Maybe I'll try to upload the file for you guys to try out. It's weird.

Espermaschine · Postby **Espermaschine** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:22 am

In my opinion you cant Union strokes, only Combine works with that.

You can Union them, after you turned the strokes into paths.

Same thing happens to me what you experienced: combine the two hearts, but as soon as i Union them, the inner one disappears (which is only logical, cause it unifies everything into one shape).

But i could be wrong, Moini definitely knows her stuff.

funkpod · Postby **funkpod** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:35 am

Here's the file, what do you guys think?

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B441tB ... sp=sharing

the heart is supposed to go in the middle.

Moini · Postby **Moini** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:35 am

Mmh. The case I mentioned seems to be valid only for paths with subpaths.... I've tried it out again, and it always removes the inner shape, if there are two separate paths.
Sorry!

Espermaschine · Postby **Espermaschine** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:39 am

*ignore this*

Moini · Postby **Moini** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:40 am

Ah. Okay.
Combine both paths that make up the heart.
Turn text to path, ungroup.
Union text with rectangle.
Create a large rectangle below everything.
Do Path -> Difference with Heart.
Do Path -> Difference with rectangle/font object
Do Path -> Break apart, delete rectangle.
Combine the rest.

Espermaschine · Postby **Espermaschine** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:59 am

I think this is it...

Needed some node editing and Fill rule reversed.

funkpod · Postby **funkpod** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 11:18 am

Moini wrote:Ah. Okay.
Combine both paths that make up the heart.
Turn text to path, ungroup.
Union text with rectangle.
Create a large rectangle below everything.
Do Path -> Difference with Heart.
Do Path -> Difference with rectangle/font object
Do Path -> Break apart, delete rectangle.
Combine the rest.

HEY! Almost there, I got lost when you wrote "Create a large rectangle below everything."

What do you mean by that?

Moini · Postby **Moini** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 11:49 am

I meant to create a rectangle below the heart that is bigger than the heart. Probably Espermaschine has found a faster way, as it sounds, though

funkpod · Postby **funkpod** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 12:06 pm

Espermaschine wrote:I think this is it...

Needed some node editing and Fill rule reversed.

hey! Thanks! How did you do it?

Lazur · Postby **Lazur** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 4:30 pm

Select rhe objects, set a red fill and lower opacity by 50% (Shift+Ctrl+F);
After that you can see the outer heart covers the object below -select it and move to bottom (End).
Select inner heart, reverse path direction (Path/Reverse).
Select the two hearts and combine them together (Ctrl+K).
After that, you can perform union on all of the objects (Ctrl++)

Polygon · Postby **Polygon** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 8:16 pm

Make it one in 4 Steps:
1. Select everything except the 2 heart paths and call "Path->union"
2. Select small heart path and go for "Path- reverse direction"
3. Select 2 heart paths and call "Path->combine"
4. Select everything and call "Path->union" - voilá.

Cheers
P.

Espermaschine · Postby **Espermaschine** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 8:26 pm

funkpod wrote:Thanks! How did you do it?

I guess i better spare you with that, you got superior solutions from the other guys !

Lazur URH wrote:Select the objects, set a red fill and lower opacity by 50%

So much easier !

Polygon wrote:2. Select small heart path and go for "Path- reverse direction"

How did you know that was required ?

Polygon · Postby **Polygon** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:43 pm

Espermaschine wrote:
Polygon wrote:2. Select small heart path and go for "Path- reverse direction"

How did you know that was required ?

Because most likely one heart is just a duplicate of the other - so the node-order will be the same and that won´t work with an additional union-Boolean operation as the outer shape will eat up all the inner content. So it´s a standard procedure. :mrgreen:

Cheers
P.

Espermaschine · Postby **Espermaschine** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:49 pm

Polygon wrote:Because most likely one heart is just a duplicate of the other - so the node-order will be the same and that won´t work with an additional union-Boolean operation as the outer shape will eat up all the inner content. So it´s a standard procedure.

Right ! Once its obvious, its obvious ! :mrgreen:

Polygon · Postby **Polygon** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 10:58 pm

Using Béziers for 27 years now - I guess I know some stuff.

Cheers
P.

Espermaschine · Postby **Espermaschine** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 11:13 pm

Thats a long time. I had guessed you are much younger.
Internet can be deceptive.

funkpod · Postby **funkpod** » Thu Mar 03, 2016 12:00 am

Polygon wrote:Make it one in 4 Steps:
1. Select everything except the 2 heart paths and call "Path->union"
2. Select small heart path and go for "Path- reverse direction"
3. Select 2 heart paths and call "Path->combine"
4. Select everything and call "Path->union" - voilá.

Cheers
P.

YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

YOU ARE THE MAN! or woman.

Lol.

Thank you all!!!

it works!

This also worked as well.

Lazur URH wrote:Select rhe objects, set a red fill and lower opacity by 50% (Shift+Ctrl+F);
After that you can see the outer heart covers the object below -select it and move to bottom (End).
Select inner heart, reverse path direction (Path/Reverse).
Select the two hearts and combine them together (Ctrl+K).
After that, you can perform union on all of the objects (Ctrl++)

I think the key is to reverse direction. I don't understand WHY it works, but i know what to do now!

THANK YOU for everyone's help! Why is there no Thumbs Up or Thanks button on this forum?

YAY! I'm so happy.

Forums are truly truly awesome.

Another question, this was made on our cutter. Is there a "simple" way to get the hanging part of the "g" to appear as a cut out or empty space in the rectangle? I know I could probably draw the bottom of the "g" on, but I didn't know if Exclusion or another function did that negative image.

https://goo.gl/photos/93jpH8wxu1TuZgA1A

Thank you, all!!! @Espermaschine, @Polygon, @Lazur URH, @Moini, thank you!!!

Polygon · Postby **Polygon** » Thu Mar 03, 2016 1:49 am

funkpod wrote:Another question, this was made on our cutter. Is there a "simple" way to get the hanging part of the "g" to appear as a cut out or empty space in the rectangle? I know I could probably draw the bottom of the "g" on, but I didn't know if Exclusion or another function did that negative image.

Same trick here:
1. Make Mr.Gough a path and ungroup
2. Select only "g" and reverse path direction
3. Select "g" and rectangle (just "fill" color, no contour) and "combine"
4. Select all and call for "Path->Unite

Cheers
P.

funkpod · Postby **funkpod** » Thu Mar 03, 2016 4:16 am

Polygon wrote:
funkpod wrote:Another question, this was made on our cutter. Is there a "simple" way to get the hanging part of the "g" to appear as a cut out or empty space in the rectangle? I know I could probably draw the bottom of the "g" on, but I didn't know if Exclusion or another function did that negative image.

Same trick here:
1. Make Mr.Gough a path and ungroup
2. Select only "g" and reverse path direction
3. Select "g" and rectangle (just "fill" color, no contour) and "combine"
4. Select all and call for "Path->Unite

Cheers
P.

Hello!

THANK YOU. I understand it, i think. Now, the question is, how will this cut out?

I have taken a picture of the files in the OUTLINE view, and that is what the laser will cut out.

As you the see, the "g" is set up, but I don't think the top portion of the "g" will stay attached to the piece of wood.

Anything that is a line will be cut, so while the bottom part of the "g" will be cut out, as planned, the top part will also fall off.

I don't know if there is a simple solution to this, other than using COMBINE and then UNION over the whole thing, and then redrawing the bottom portion of the "g" as a separate object and importing that on top and sending it to the laser.

here's a pic of what i mean.

https://docs.google.com/drawings/d/1KDn ... sp=sharing

What you posted would be the solution of it was just going to be printed out on paper, but maybe not for lines for a laser cutter.

Any thoughts?

Polygon · Postby **Polygon** » Thu Mar 03, 2016 5:19 am

If you want to be safe you can increase the intersection and put an extra cut out "bottom part" of the "g" for an Boolean division operation:

Cheers
P.

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Help with using Combine and Union on a Bezier Curve and Shape

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