This is a read-only archive of the inkscapeforum.com site. You can search for info here or post new questions and comments at Let's consider the letter "s" in times new roman. Size 400 pt
The chacarter changes the line's tickness, with thin and tick lines.
Change it to an traced object
Now say that we need to create a similar object, that has a border of 5mm more (or 5mm less) relative to the size of the "s" letter.
(We will use the two traced curve to cut out some real plexiglass letters and overlap them)
Problems:
We cannot simply scale up/down the "s" object, beause the gap between the two objects will not have a constat size with normal scaling.
Nor we can't apply a border to the object with said tickess, because we will not change the real size of the object. If we use the second object to cut out a cnc plexiglass letter, it will be the same size of the first one.
I tried also to use an object with a border to mask/clip out a given shape, but again what was used by inkscape in the clipping was the "real" trace curve, that's to said without the tickness.
How can we obtain such border effect, increasing the REAL size o the object ?
increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
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Giuliano69
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2014 12:32 am
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tylerdurden
- Posts: 2344
- Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:04 pm
- Location: Michigan, USA
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
Have a nice day.
I'm using Inkscape 0.92.2 (5c3e80d, 2017-08-06), 64 bit win8.1
The Inkscape manual has lots of helpful info! http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/
I'm using Inkscape 0.92.2 (5c3e80d, 2017-08-06), 64 bit win8.1
The Inkscape manual has lots of helpful info! http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/
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Giuliano69
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2014 12:32 am
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
thanks tyler for your help !!
It seems that this tecnique is something specifically made for shrinking/enlarging (inset/outset)
Top
It seems that this tecnique is something specifically made for shrinking/enlarging (inset/outset)
Top
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
You can set that in the inkscape preferences panel, or
use dynamic offsetting instead.
Once dynamic offsetting is set, you can precisely set the radius of it in the xml editor (Shift+Ctrl+X).
Somehow though, adding a stroke to the path and converting the stroke to path can be a more accurate solution at times.
use dynamic offsetting instead.
Once dynamic offsetting is set, you can precisely set the radius of it in the xml editor (Shift+Ctrl+X).
Somehow though, adding a stroke to the path and converting the stroke to path can be a more accurate solution at times.
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Giuliano69
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2014 12:32 am
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
Hi Lazur,
thanks for your hint !
Unfortunately I believe that the radius propriety doesn't solve the problem to set an exact offset radius in millimeter.
As a test (i.e. that we cannot set how many mm to offset the second layer) we can check these:
When you say
What do you mean to convert the stroke into a path ? Which command is to be used ?
Anyway, shouldn't it always be set to the CENTER of the stroke line, the result being the same path line of the original object ?
Thanks for your kind help !
thanks for your hint !
Unfortunately I believe that the radius propriety doesn't solve the problem to set an exact offset radius in millimeter.
As a test (i.e. that we cannot set how many mm to offset the second layer) we can check these:
- the extrude [ctrl-) ] settings in document proprieties. We can see that the normal step of increase can be set, but ONLY in pixel:
- the xml proprieties can be set the inkscape:radius propriety, but the said propriety is WITHOUT a unit of measure. Probably it is a pixel unit but by sure it si NOT a millimeter unit (we can try with a square of given size, dym. offset it, set the radius propriety, and check the final size in millimiter...)
When you say
Somehow though, adding a stroke to the path and converting the stroke to path can be a more accurate solution at times.
What do you mean to convert the stroke into a path ? Which command is to be used ?
Anyway, shouldn't it always be set to the CENTER of the stroke line, the result being the same path line of the original object ?
Thanks for your kind help !
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
Hi.
Oh I wasn't aware of that the core is computed as pixels.
Inkscape is working with 90 dpi, which means 25,4mm=90 pixels;
1 mm =90/25,4=3,5433 pixels. Less accurate, but it shouldn't cause troubles.
Maybe there is an xml file where all these preferences are saved, where you could write more digits, if you open that up in a notepad, but not sure if it would work.
Anyway if you are worried about accuracy, you can increase it in the preferences under svg output.
A quick example: for a 15 mm offset, I tried to write the most digits possible, 53,19606299 and it turned to 53.19606399536133 once set, with the default svg-output settings.
Once the offsetted path was converted to a path (Ctrl+Shift+C), the inaccuracy was about 0,011 mm-s, but maybe with a more precise output setting previously made, that could be even better.
To convert a stroke to a path press Ctrl+Alt+C when it is selected.
The problems with it are that you have to use the double size of the offset on the basic path as stroke width,
and that once converted to a path you will have two strokes that are a combination of the inner and outer offsetted path.
So it would need a bit more work, with breaking the resulted path apart (Ctrl+Shift+K), deleting unnecessary previous subpaths, then combining the rest togehter (Ctrl+K).
Cannot give a nice example for comparison as mostly offsetting with the dynamic offset option can give a good result, but whenever an issue appears with it, using strokes instead can be the solution.
Good luck!
Oh I wasn't aware of that the core is computed as pixels.
Inkscape is working with 90 dpi, which means 25,4mm=90 pixels;
1 mm =90/25,4=3,5433 pixels. Less accurate, but it shouldn't cause troubles.
Maybe there is an xml file where all these preferences are saved, where you could write more digits, if you open that up in a notepad, but not sure if it would work.
Anyway if you are worried about accuracy, you can increase it in the preferences under svg output.
A quick example: for a 15 mm offset, I tried to write the most digits possible, 53,19606299 and it turned to 53.19606399536133 once set, with the default svg-output settings.
Once the offsetted path was converted to a path (Ctrl+Shift+C), the inaccuracy was about 0,011 mm-s, but maybe with a more precise output setting previously made, that could be even better.
To convert a stroke to a path press Ctrl+Alt+C when it is selected.
The problems with it are that you have to use the double size of the offset on the basic path as stroke width,
and that once converted to a path you will have two strokes that are a combination of the inner and outer offsetted path.
So it would need a bit more work, with breaking the resulted path apart (Ctrl+Shift+K), deleting unnecessary previous subpaths, then combining the rest togehter (Ctrl+K).
Cannot give a nice example for comparison as mostly offsetting with the dynamic offset option can give a good result, but whenever an issue appears with it, using strokes instead can be the solution.
Good luck!
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Giuliano69
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2014 12:32 am
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
Hi.
I got back with this thread with version 0.92, and I'm having some TROUBLE with the Path->EXTRUDE command.
If I convert the text to path and try to extrude some path of letters [ ctrl+) ], the path gets DEFORMED....
Any idea why it is happening ?
SVG Image link
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B47WYSOcCkIcOGdKblZXNXpnNjQ
I also trued to edit the path and to force the vertex/node to be sharp and segment to be straight lines, but nothing changes...
I got back with this thread with version 0.92, and I'm having some TROUBLE with the Path->EXTRUDE command.
If I convert the text to path and try to extrude some path of letters [ ctrl+) ], the path gets DEFORMED....
Any idea why it is happening ?
SVG Image link
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B47WYSOcCkIcOGdKblZXNXpnNjQ
I also trued to edit the path and to force the vertex/node to be sharp and segment to be straight lines, but nothing changes...
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
it looks to me like the deformations depend on the absolute size.
I don't know why. Rounding errors...?
See attached picture.
So, if you start with relative large letters (on the left) you probably don't get such strong distortions.
In contrast, if you start with relative small letters (on the right) you will get distortions.
The red letters are just the upscaled small black letters after applying Path | Outset
So, my recommendation is to start with large letters, do your Outset and then scale it down again to your desired size.
Not nice but it seems to work. And maybe somebody else can comment on the distortions. I also would be interested in knowing why this happens.
I don't know why. Rounding errors...?
See attached picture.
So, if you start with relative large letters (on the left) you probably don't get such strong distortions.
In contrast, if you start with relative small letters (on the right) you will get distortions.
The red letters are just the upscaled small black letters after applying Path | Outset
So, my recommendation is to start with large letters, do your Outset and then scale it down again to your desired size.
Not nice but it seems to work. And maybe somebody else can comment on the distortions. I also would be interested in knowing why this happens.
- OutsetDistortions.png (11.36 KiB) Viewed 4187 times
Win7/64, Inkscape 0.92.2
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tylerdurden
- Posts: 2344
- Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:04 pm
- Location: Michigan, USA
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
The extreme distortions in the OP's file are due to the scale set in the document properties. (See attached revision)
I suggest using a default template of display units px and scale=1 ( or: mm, scale=3.77953).
As for the creation of smooth nodes, I don't know.
I suggest using a default template of display units px and scale=1 ( or: mm, scale=3.77953).
As for the creation of smooth nodes, I don't know.
- Attachments
-
- extrude-scale377953.svg
- apply a 3px outset to this file
- (5.07 KiB) Downloaded 173 times
Have a nice day.
I'm using Inkscape 0.92.2 (5c3e80d, 2017-08-06), 64 bit win8.1
The Inkscape manual has lots of helpful info! http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/
I'm using Inkscape 0.92.2 (5c3e80d, 2017-08-06), 64 bit win8.1
The Inkscape manual has lots of helpful info! http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/
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Giuliano69
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2014 12:32 am
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
@theozh
thanks for your suggestion.
I already considered this behaviour was due to the size; last time I used the extrude function, the image was about 1 m x 0,5m …. (a plexiglass signboard) and everything worked as expected.
This time I started working from an A4 size, and truly speaking the function failed…
I think that it should be considered as a formal Bug
@tylerdurden
Using an Ubuntu 16,04 with Inkscape 0.92.2 , a new document shows a scale of 1
Using your value (scale=3.77953) the bug is less present, but if you zoom the image the square corner are gone….
BTW… why a so strange scale=3.77953 ??
Thanks guys for your help
thanks for your suggestion.
I already considered this behaviour was due to the size; last time I used the extrude function, the image was about 1 m x 0,5m …. (a plexiglass signboard) and everything worked as expected.
This time I started working from an A4 size, and truly speaking the function failed…
I think that it should be considered as a formal Bug
@tylerdurden
Using an Ubuntu 16,04 with Inkscape 0.92.2 , a new document shows a scale of 1
Using your value (scale=3.77953) the bug is less present, but if you zoom the image the square corner are gone….
BTW… why a so strange scale=3.77953 ??
Thanks guys for your help
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
BTW… why a so strange scale=3.77953 ??
I've been trying to find out from developers why they did this bizarre (imo) and confusing thing with Inkscape units and the scale setting. The discussion is ongoing, and I haven't checked my mail yet today. But my current understanding, it sounds like the decision was little more than a whim. If I find out more, I certainly will post. It sure must have been a lot of work, for the stated reason though.
For some reason, developers want Inkscape to use mm as default units, and that's what has created the need for the Scale setting. I hope I will either find out the reason, or can convince them to go back to the previous setup, which was quite straightforward and not confusing.
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Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
(The scale setting is still useful for makers who need their numbers inside the SVG code in the correct unit, because their programs are broken and cannot read the viewbox, or for those who hand-write parts of their SVG. But it sure is an advanced setting.)
Something doesn't work? - Keeping an eye on the status bar can save you a lot of time!
Inkscape FAQ - Learning Resources - Website with tutorials (German and English)
Inkscape FAQ - Learning Resources - Website with tutorials (German and English)
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flamingolady
- Posts: 687
- Joined: Wed Jun 10, 2009 1:40 pm
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
Just a comment - he originally used Lazur's formula- when Inkscape was using 90 as a scale and now it's 96, could that be throwing it off somehow? Can't determine is he's using the old file or new one. Maybe he needs to recalculate using 96? (I really don't know). Also, instead of using outset, I wonder if dynamic offset would create the same distortion, though i tend to get more distortion the larger I go with that.
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
Update on Display Units and Scale.
I ended up making a feature request to return Inkscape to it's old way of handling units: https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape/+bug/1719162
Sure, mm is convenient for those who use Inkscape for real world projects, as opposed to online projects. (Perhaps it was a gift for the makers who hosted the recent hackfest in Paris?) But I don't think Inkscape should be groomed one way or the other. I think Inkscape should be reverted to the unit handling of old, where all anyone had to do was click once in Document Properties, to change units.
If you agree, please visit that bug report, and click "This affects me too" (or it's something close to that). Theoretically (although not usually in practice) the more people who are affected, the faster a bug gets fixed. But there's certainly no harm in trying!
I ended up making a feature request to return Inkscape to it's old way of handling units: https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape/+bug/1719162
Sure, mm is convenient for those who use Inkscape for real world projects, as opposed to online projects. (Perhaps it was a gift for the makers who hosted the recent hackfest in Paris?) But I don't think Inkscape should be groomed one way or the other. I think Inkscape should be reverted to the unit handling of old, where all anyone had to do was click once in Document Properties, to change units.
If you agree, please visit that bug report, and click "This affects me too" (or it's something close to that). Theoretically (although not usually in practice) the more people who are affected, the faster a bug gets fixed. But there's certainly no harm in trying!
Basics - Help menu > Tutorials
Manual - Inkscape: Guide to a Vector Drawing Program
Inkscape Community - Inkscape FAQ - Gallery
Inkscape for Cutting Design
Manual - Inkscape: Guide to a Vector Drawing Program
Inkscape Community - Inkscape FAQ - Gallery
Inkscape for Cutting Design
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tylerdurden
- Posts: 2344
- Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:04 pm
- Location: Michigan, USA
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
The "old way of handling units" is not possible, nor is it a useful way to view the issues regarding scale.
As discussed in March of this year and the subsequent bug report, the biggest issue is not how units and scale are handled internally, but how the default.svg (excl. px template) have gotten users off on the wrong foot.
As discussed in March of this year and the subsequent bug report, the biggest issue is not how units and scale are handled internally, but how the default.svg (excl. px template) have gotten users off on the wrong foot.
There is an issue with the default.svg templates since 0.92.0: Inkscape has been updated to process internally with a basic relationship of 96px/in. The metric equivalent would be 3.77953px/mm. However, the default mm templates that open with each new document have the setting of 1px/mm. This creates a number of problems, and in the case of outsets, makes a minor problem worse.Giuliano69 wrote:@tylerdurden
Using an Ubuntu 16,04 with Inkscape 0.92.2 , a new document shows a scale of 1
Using your value (scale=3.77953) the bug is less present, but if you zoom the image the square corner are gone….
BTW… why a so strange scale=3.77953 ??
Have a nice day.
I'm using Inkscape 0.92.2 (5c3e80d, 2017-08-06), 64 bit win8.1
The Inkscape manual has lots of helpful info! http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/
I'm using Inkscape 0.92.2 (5c3e80d, 2017-08-06), 64 bit win8.1
The Inkscape manual has lots of helpful info! http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/
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tylerdurden
- Posts: 2344
- Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:04 pm
- Location: Michigan, USA
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
This is not to say that the Document Properties panel is perfect... it could be better by some simple changes.
But the bigger issue is the default templates... even the "Inches" template has a scale of 1px/in.
For the technically inclined:
http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php ... n_Inkscape
But the bigger issue is the default templates... even the "Inches" template has a scale of 1px/in.
For the technically inclined:
http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php ... n_Inkscape
Have a nice day.
I'm using Inkscape 0.92.2 (5c3e80d, 2017-08-06), 64 bit win8.1
The Inkscape manual has lots of helpful info! http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/
I'm using Inkscape 0.92.2 (5c3e80d, 2017-08-06), 64 bit win8.1
The Inkscape manual has lots of helpful info! http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
Oh, is that wiki current? I'll like to it in that new faq, if so.
Basics - Help menu > Tutorials
Manual - Inkscape: Guide to a Vector Drawing Program
Inkscape Community - Inkscape FAQ - Gallery
Inkscape for Cutting Design
Manual - Inkscape: Guide to a Vector Drawing Program
Inkscape Community - Inkscape FAQ - Gallery
Inkscape for Cutting Design
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
Tav wrote it to provide info for those who would work on the unit change. The technical info is still correct.
Something doesn't work? - Keeping an eye on the status bar can save you a lot of time!
Inkscape FAQ - Learning Resources - Website with tutorials (German and English)
Inkscape FAQ - Learning Resources - Website with tutorials (German and English)
Re: increase/decrease object by a given border size ?
Awesome! Thanks 
Basics - Help menu > Tutorials
Manual - Inkscape: Guide to a Vector Drawing Program
Inkscape Community - Inkscape FAQ - Gallery
Inkscape for Cutting Design
Manual - Inkscape: Guide to a Vector Drawing Program
Inkscape Community - Inkscape FAQ - Gallery
Inkscape for Cutting Design
