| ted | === START MEETING == Agenda: * SFC Items (ted) * Student programs (Outreachy, GSoC, etc) ( @Tav ) * Developer meeting update (Mc) * Vectors update (?) * Infrastructure update ( @doctormo ) * Security Key Program (Mc) | 17:02 |
|---|---|---|
| Mc | o/ | 17:03 |
| ted | * AI Import Project ( @joneuhauser ) * Partners Program (ted) * Bugfix Program ( @joneuhauser ) * Current Votes Status * Next Meeting: April 7, 2023 Cool, I'll start out with SFC stuff. SFC Stuff, we've got the usual dump from SFC: https://gitlab.com/-/snippets/2514556 This is one of the first time in the last couple years the current balance is less than the starting balance, which is pretty cool. But, it doesn't include Paypal donations past Jan 31, so it could actually be higher. We've had various things we've allocated hit the accounts, but the biggest is the venue for the Hackfest. A break down on allocated stuff is here: https://office.inkscape.org/nextcloud/index.php/s/P6YArrZGzFXJ4FR Are there any questions on the financials? | 17:03 |
| Mc | 5.4k in one month is less than last year average, right ? (do we have a breakdown of income per month somewhere ?) | 17:05 |
| ted | Yes, it is slightly, but I think that last year we saw less in Jan Uhm, we did one last year, but I'm not sure where it is right now. | 17:06 |
| doctormo | Yes, though this makes sense, there's a hump after the release. | 17:06 |
| ted | I'm not sure any one month can be extrapolated out though, generally. It is never that even. | 17:06 |
| joneuhauser | Just want to reiterate something from the discussion at the Hackfest this morning: it would be useful to have access to the messages that users leave when making a donation. @pono | 17:07 |
| ted | @joneuhauser, do you have any idea how you want those? I can put them as part of the report. | 17:07 |
| Mc | they have to be manually striped of personal info before put online, probably | 17:08 |
| pono | The paypal donations include those, and are wrapped in the report I send to Ted. | 17:08 |
| ted | Yes, for sure. That is one of the big issues, they'd have to be stripped out. | 17:08 |
| Mc | ah, so ted is hoarding the info :D | 17:08 |
| doctormo | :-) | 17:08 |
| joneuhauser | We can scrub the names before. But the messages itself we could probably put in the office without further editing. | 17:09 |
| ted | Which is why I was asking about the format, I can pull them out in a bunch of ways. | 17:09 |
| pono | better keeping metadata private by default :) | 17:09 |
| joneuhauser | (names implied paypal address and so on) | 17:09 |
| ted | Well, most of them don't have comments. So there's have to be some "compression" -- I can figure something out. | 17:09 |
| joneuhauser | awesome. THanks :) | 17:10 |
| Mc | a csv should probably do it (on office.inkscape.org) | 17:10 |
| ted | Yeah, I think I saw a tool that'll to CSV operations. Have to look that up again. Cool, so next topic? * Student programs (Outreachy, GSoC, etc) ( @Tav ) | 17:10 |
| Tav | We've been accepted into GSoC again. Lots of student interest. | 17:11 |
| pono | \\o/ | 17:11 |
| c.rogers | Woo! | 17:11 |
| ted | Nice! I think all the project stuff is setup, is there anything else we need to do there? Or just wait until there are applications? Have we suggested that Vectors promote it? Or are we seeing too much interest? | 17:11 |
| Tav | Waiting at the moment. It wouldn't hurt to have it promoted. Deadline is April 4th for student applications. | 17:13 |
| Mc | not "too much", no maybe a social media push ? | 17:13 |
| Tav | s/student/contributor/ | 17:13 |
| ted | Oh, that's right. I'm still not adjusted to that :-) Yeah, I think a social media push makes sense. If nothing else it generates excitement about the projects. I think we may have missed the Vectors meeting for this month though. | 17:14 |
| doctormo | There's some vectors news which will important for the many outreach items we will want to do. | 17:15 |
| ted | Do they like GL issues for stuff like that? | 17:15 |
| Mc | opengl issues ? | 17:16 |
| doctormo | Yes gitlab can be used to make a news article request. | 17:16 |
| c.rogers | It's the only issue tracker we have. (GitLab) | 17:16 |
| ted | Gitlab | 17:16 |
| Mc | ah, gitlab, never saw the acronym like that before ^^ | 17:16 |
| c.rogers | It would be good to get folks used to using it. | 17:16 |
| c.rogers | Everything else is there. | 17:17 |
| c.rogers | I'll go ahead and ask. | 17:17 |
| ted | K, @Tav would mind taking the issue to setup a Gitlab issue for GSoC media? | 17:17 |
| c.rogers | Because I think it's all speculation otherwise. | 17:17 |
| ted | Okay, thanks @c.rogers I'll go ahead and kick of the next point while he's checking on that. * Developer meeting update (Mc) | 17:18 |
| Mc | I missed latest dev meeting ^^ but we mostly agreed here to delay the release by two months to give more time to alpha and beta testing and to fork 1.3.x at the beta release | 17:18 |
| Tav | OK | 17:18 |
| ted | Oh, okay. Is that June then? | 17:19 |
| Mc | late june or early july also there were developer discussions for hiring a 2-people team to make progress on the gtk4 front | 17:19 |
| ted | K, so that'd put the fork before GSoC though, so that'd probably work out. | 17:19 |
| Mc | the idea is to allow master to be broken as soon as possible :p | 17:20 |
| doctormo | We've had some more discussions about the Gtk4 proposal at the hackfest | 17:20 |
| ted | Haha, hopefully not broken 😉 | 17:20 |
| Mc | yeah, the proposal is pretty much all written and ready | 17:21 |
| joneuhauser | A vote about that will be sent out this week. | 17:21 |
| ted | Perhaps send it out to the ML so folks can comment who aren't at the hackfest? Make it a bit easier to incorporate comments. | 17:21 |
| doctormo | Developer mailing list? | 17:21 |
| ted | And/or PLC mailing list. | 17:21 |
| joneuhauser | It was posted to the chat (and discussed multiple times in the last developer meetings). | 17:21 |
| joneuhauser | The relevant devs have read it. (I've received written feedback from those that are not here about it) | 17:22 |
| pono | And has led to some productive chats about future budgeting and similar issues :) | 17:22 |
| doctormo | It's worth having the proposal drafted before it goes to a vote. So votes can be made quickly and without too much comment afterwards. | 17:23 |
| ted | Certainly, but I think that generally everyone in the project should feel welcome to comment and share ideas. | 17:23 |
| joneuhauser | All but one PLC member is here (and we've had intensive discussions) - but sure we can send it to the list. | 17:23 |
| doctormo | Sounds like a plan. | 17:24 |
| ted | Great, I think that would be helpful. Next up: * Vectors update (?) ? there is because as I think most folks know Ryan has stepped down as Vectors lead. I hear that @c.rogers might give us an update? | 17:24 |
| c.rogers | Sure. | 17:25 |
| c.rogers | Now that I have coffee. lol | 17:25 |
| ted | We'll expect it twice as fast with coffee 😉 | 17:25 |
| c.rogers | (5th cup of coffee) ;) | 17:26 |
| c.rogers | Anyway, Ryan has stepped away from the vectors for a bit. | 17:26 |
| ted | 5x hacker | 17:26 |
| c.rogers | He needs to handle RL stuff. So the Vectors basically need to choose a new head of the Vectors. | 17:27 |
| c.rogers | I guess. | 17:27 |
| ted | Is that something they have a process to do, or does the PLC need to help out in some way? | 17:27 |
| doctormo | Does vectors need any help to do recruitment or guidence for the process? | 17:27 |
| ted | We've not really had a process for that, it was kinda built by Ryan. | 17:28 |
| c.rogers | Possibly. I could step up and fill in for some of it if the current Vectors members want that. | 17:28 |
| doctormo | @c.rogers If you would, let us know if you need any help. There's an existing meeting schedule for vectors. | 17:29 |
| c.rogers | Or I could just start doing stuff. lol | 17:29 |
| ted | Yeah, I think we also have the problem of not having a set of official Vectors members, so how that'd be defined. | 17:29 |
| c.rogers | Well, it was my intention to do more recreuitment from the Facebook group, since it's one of our biggest communities, and everyone is super friendly. | 17:29 |
| doctormo | https://inkscape.org/*inkscape-vectors/ <- people are here, might need some editing | 17:30 |
| doctormo | @c.rogers You can use that list as a first step in recruitment and then remove people who are no longer available. | 17:31 |
| ted | So yeah, perhaps we give it a bit and see where we go there. I don't know if we need to start building a policy there. Perhaps for officially defining subgroups. We've discussed that a few times, but we really haven't taken any action on it. Maybe this should kick us into action there. | 17:32 |
| doctormo | It's a good idea, we have some infrastructure to do teams, and have them define what recruitment looks like for themselves. | 17:33 |
| c.rogers | We had previously decided to let groups build their own policy for most things. | 17:33 |
| ted | Yeah, if nothing else we had that because we didn't define anything 😉 | 17:34 |
| c.rogers | Yep! Well, Ryan did a great job organising it. | 17:34 |
| ted | Not sure that we officially said that they should, but I'm fine with that. We may want to officially say that if it is what we want. | 17:34 |
| doctormo | Note: we have a similar issue in the testing team with Nathan leaving. | 17:34 |
| joneuhauser | Teams should organize themselves. The testing team e.g. had a very loose sense of a leadership position. I don't see a reason to organize this centrally. | 17:35 |
| doctormo | I agree | 17:35 |
| ted | Hmmm, yeah. I don't want a lot of procedure, but we may need something to make people feel official. | 17:36 |
| c.rogers | Me too. | 17:36 |
| c.rogers | We have stickers and mugs to make people feel official. ;) | 17:36 |
| c.rogers | Also that page on the website. | 17:36 |
| doctormo | It's worth having a short list of titles that a team can fill out on their team page. How to join, what kinds of tasks are available, what the chatroom is etc. | 17:36 |
| joneuhauser | If a team wants to have a leader, they can elect / appoint/ roll the dice on one. | 17:36 |
| doctormo | A light list, rather than a regulation | 17:36 |
| ted | Heh, can we get pins, then I think folks are official. | 17:36 |
| pono | The dev team has been doing a good job leading by example of reporting to the PLC about it's goings on, so I'd just add that more communication between the groups and the PLC helps everyone stay up to date and be heard. | 17:37 |
| c.rogers | PIn them in place, so they can't leave? ;) | 17:37 |
| doctormo | lol | 17:37 |
| doctormo | We should make people feel welcome, yes. | 17:37 |
| ted | pono, I think that's a good point. Perhaps we just have something like someone who schedules meetings, less of "leader" | 17:37 |
| c.rogers | I've stepped down from the PLC, so that should give me a lot more time to help with recruitment and (possibly) organisation. | 17:38 |
| RdH | Feels like we're becoming more and more bureaucratic... | 17:38 |
| RdH | Not a fan. | 17:38 |
| c.rogers | Yea, I don't like that either. Though some organisation is good. | 17:39 |
| joneuhauser | The testing team (for example) never had meetings. It reports on its work by going to the dev meetings. That's self-organizing and should stay that way. | 17:39 |
| ted | @RdH, sure, and I don't want to go too far down that path. But people are sometimes scared to overstep their bounds if not given some guidance on what those are. | 17:39 |
| RdH | We're not a company *yet* but take on a lot of overhead as if we were | 17:39 |
| doctormo | @RdH The only requirement is really to help teams with structures that allow them to grow. Like a wooden framework a plant will grow on | 17:39 |
| c.rogers | When people come to donate time, we want to give them a good exprience, not a messy room. | 17:39 |
| c.rogers | So we'll see. | 17:40 |
| doctormo | Thanks Chris, keep up infomed of the goings on if you can. | 17:40 |
| c.rogers | :thumbsup: | 17:40 |
| ted | Okay, I think we're in agreement on the issues, but we need to come up with a plan forward. I'll suggest some ideas at the hackfest and see if we can propose something later this week. Next up: * Security Key Program (Mc) | 17:40 |
| Mc | (on my list of things to discuss with pono :D) | 17:40 |
| pono | :) | 17:41 |
| ted | Great * AI Import Project ( @joneuhauser ) | 17:41 |
| Mc | @nicco ^ | 17:41 |
| joneuhauser | Going well so far. We're getting a feel for the format. | 17:41 |
| ted | And after that: * Bugfix Program ( @joneuhauser ) (so just go with it) | 17:41 |
| joneuhauser | AI Import: Progress is adequate. I feel like we have a very solid foundation to structure the code, so we can start implementing more and more features. | 17:42 |
| NPJ2000 | @niccokunzmann ^^ | 17:42 |
| joneuhauser | Bugfix program: Martin has already fixed quite a few issues, Rafael has also published the first 2 (?) MRs. Contract spans one year, so no hurry (and the release is still 4 months away - we want to have some hours left for bugs that are found last minute) | 17:42 |
| joneuhauser | AI: Something that might be interesting for all projects, Nicco has implemented a pipeline check with the REUSE license compliance tool. | 17:43 |
| ted | Cool, excited to see how both of those turn out. | 17:43 |
| ted | Though, I don't have any AI files anymore 😉 | 17:43 |
| doctormo | Try ChatGPT ;-) | 17:43 |
| c.rogers | I can make you some. | 17:43 |
| ted | Ah, cool. That'll be great. Didn't we already have a license checker of some kind? | 17:43 |
| joneuhauser | Not in extensions (or any of those subprojects). | 17:44 |
| ted | I good. No files needed. 😉 Ah, I see. Great, I love that check as much as it catches me up sometimes. | 17:44 |
| c.rogers | Awesome. Keep me out of Windows. lol | 17:44 |
| ted | Okay, it seems I forgot: * Infrastructure update ( @doctormo ) | 17:44 |
| doctormo | Small fixes to the calendar this month. The emails for the wiki were changes, but I got reports from pono that he wasn't getting any emails, I may follow up with OSUOSL | 17:45 |
| RdH | Should we discuss a transfer of credentials from Patrick (MacStadium) to someone who is more active? Or is that already the case? | 17:45 |
| ted | Ah, cool. I started getting the emails again, so that was a gain on my side at least. | 17:46 |
| doctormo | Good to hear. | 17:46 |
| ted | @RdH, are they in the keyring? | 17:46 |
| RdH | I have no clue | 17:46 |
| joneuhauser | We've also started cleaning up the wiki at the Hackfest. Infra might be the closest point on the agenda. | 17:46 |
| doctormo | No mac credentials in our keyring | 17:47 |
| ted | Oh, nice, Wiki gardening is always useful. I'm sure there's some old embarrassing stuff in there. | 17:47 |
| doctormo | We've got a few ideas for improving that, like randomly deleting pages and seeing if anyone notices ;-) | 17:47 |
| ted | Hmm, okay. We should make sure to get the creds even if Patrick still wants to work on it some. | 17:48 |
| joneuhauser | Less gardening than plowing up... 90%+ is outdated, wrong or completely useless. | 17:48 |
| ted | @doctormo, I'm not saying that won't work..... | 17:48 |
| doctormo | And cluttering our google search results. | 17:48 |
| ted | Hmm, wonder if the wiki should be norobots... seems like we're not using it for user docs as much. | 17:49 |
| Mc | no, userdocs go to the website | 17:49 |
| doctormo | But the review is ongoing, we may make it a regular meeting thing. Perhaps to ignight a docs team and me and jonathan can just hang out and delete some wiki each month. | 17:49 |
| ted | Do we want people to find the stuff in the Wiki? | 17:49 |
| joneuhauser | Yup. People will mistake UX proposals for existing features, for example. Or find that Inkscape doesn't support $thing because that was true in 0.37 (and never again) | 17:49 |
| joneuhauser | Once we've removed the (undisputable) garbage, I'll make a proposal what to do with the rest. | 17:50 |
| ted | Sounds good, thanks @joneuhauser Next up: * Partners Program (ted) | 17:50 |
| c.rogers | Yea, I'd vote to withdraw from wiki activities. I don't know anyone who uses them these days. It's just one more thing of questionable value to maintain. | 17:50 |
| ted | That is on my todo list for the hackfest, I hope to have a proposal out this week. Next up: * Current Votes Status We've got an election update that went out today. If folks could look and vote on that. Also we have an open vote on mentor stipends, if you haven't voted on that please do. | 17:50 |
| joneuhauser | @c.rogers @Tav is (dev docs), Maren and Adam use it for release notes creation. Translators have information about common naming schemes there. | 17:51 |
| ted | Last up: * Next Meeting: April 7, 2023 | 17:52 |
| c.rogers | Oh yea, forgot the release notes are there. | 17:52 |
| Mc | missing votes for this one are tav and scislac[m] ? | 17:52 |
| ted | I think it's useful to use as a scratch pad, but generally, not user docs. | 17:52 |
| c.rogers | I guess it's more accessable than GitLab to the general public. | 17:52 |
| joneuhauser | [ ](https://chat.inkscape.org/channel/leadership_committee?msg=fbnyxKqaQAxZf973T) I don't see a vote from Ted either. | 17:53 |
| joneuhauser | Scratch that, confused the votes. | 17:53 |
| ted | Mc: I don't have a mentor stipends vote recorded for you either, but I might have missed it. I can double check. Cool, gonna call it. ==== END MEETING ==== Thanks everyone! | 17:54 |
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