Inkscape Board Meeting Transcript for Friday, 2021-11-12

ponoHullo!18:00
Mchello !18:00
ted\u0001ACTION waves\u0001
Whoo! Hoo! Meeting time.
Am I the only one here?
18:03
McI don't think so18:04
ponoI'm here :)18:04
tedChecking the RC bridge and it seems to be sending messages as well.
I guess changing the week messed everyone up.
18:05
Mchere it's mostly a non-working day18:05
tedAh, so perhaps people are with family.
Anyway, I don't have much to say other than the votes stuff on the mailing list.
I'll try to get those closed and the docs updated.
And the financial report is here: https://gitlab.com/-/snippets/2205952
There
's basically no change.
SFC is still working on changing payment processors, hoping for this month or next.
18:06
McI don't have access18:07
tedMc: Do you have any thing from the dev meetings?
Mc: try again, sorry forgot to click the public box.
18:07
Mcnot particularly, there are interrogations about the status of \18:08
tedWas that something they were working on, or a long term idea?
I thought it was just something they thought they should do eventually.
18:08
Mcit was ticket 1391618:09
ponoWe are trying to track down all the updates to the Apple licensing agreements.
It's been a while since we last took a look and need our legal counsel to review all the new documents.
I'll post (or have Pam) a reply when we have reviewed them.
18:09
tedpono: in the end though do you expect us to change the way we build binaries? Or just keep up on the legal stuff?18:09
ponoI don't anticipate needing to make any changes, but can't guarantee that.18:10
Mcpono: thanks for the update :)18:10
tedK, cool. So we'll continue the way we are until we hear otherwise πŸ˜ƒ18:10
pono+118:11
Mcthere was an idea to organize a small hackfest, maybe virtual, maybe in-person for europeans if possible in january to get to 1.1.218:11
tedMc: Did we need any review for the Windows store?
Oh, that'd be a cool idea
Is LGM happening this year?
18:11
Mcdunno yet
well
18:12
tedK, we might considering doing a hackfest near that as well. That's always been successful.18:12
McI think it will happen between april and june  but there has been no announcement yet18:12
TavHi all, sorry to be late.18:13
tedAlso, when is FOSDEM, would it make sense to do something near that? Not sure if many of our European devs go or not.18:13
Mcafaict nothing was updated since everything was ok for us @windows - there is still the question of having the account include the SFC fiscal information, and to see what can be done around monetization
fosdem will be virtual
( https://fosdem.org/2022/news/2021-10-22-fosdem-online-2022/ )
(Feb 5-6)
18:13
tedAh, okay. Makes sense.
What is the conference in Germany that @moini had a hackfest with?
It was a few years back.
18:14
Mckielux ?
( https://kielux.de/ )
18:15
tedSounds right. Just seeing if there's something we could work near, makes planning easier.18:16
TavWe might have a harder time finding space to share...18:17
Mcit would seem there is a talk on Inkscape by Maren tomorrow at Tux Tage18:18
tedNot sure about Europe, but at least in Texas that isn't much an issue anymore.18:18
TavGermany's covid rate is climbing fast right now.18:18
tedHmm, not in Germany then.18:19
TavBut by spring it will probably be down again.18:19
tedYeah, it might make more sense to plan for Spring than Jan/Feb.18:19
RdHSorry to intercept, I was in another appointment. macOS signing: if we are ok to continue as before, I'm going to file a reimbursement request for this year (June 2021-2022).18:20
Mcsure18:20
tedRdH, +1
I guess we need a board vote. I'll do that after I close those others.
It is $100, correct?
18:21
RdH99 €, so it's a bit more in $18:22
tedAh, yes. I figured Apple charged in USD. We should be able to do Euros.
So nice of them to tax us in local currencies πŸ˜‰
18:22
Mcwhen 1€>1$ US companies tend to charge europeans with 1:1 rate18:23
doctormoEh 1:1 is about right these days :-)18:23
tedI'd like to say that's to make the marketing budget cheaper, but I doubt that's the reason.18:24
Mc\18:24
tedSo WRT to the sprint/get together thing, the biggest thing we need is a planner. Is that you Mc? Or is someone else working on it.18:25
Mccurrently it's just an idea, we'd need to gauge interest18:25
doctormoConclusion from yesterday's meeting: No organiser available currently.18:25
tedK, is that a \18:26
doctormoIt's an administrative task, so I was going to ask you to ask Josh ;-)18:26
tedIf we need plane tickets 8wk out, we're already middle of Jan at the absolute earliest.18:27
doctormoI don't think the idea is to have an in person event, but Mc, can you confirm?18:27
McI'd be open to invite people around, but mostly those who can cancel with minimal fees and issues, we can't know 2 month in advance how the situation will evolve18:28
scislac[m]So sorry to be running behind.
Going to read the log real quick.
18:29
TavWe talked about an online event, with maybe a little in person meeting at Mc's work place.18:29
doctormoSo no planes needed, that's a net positive.18:29
Mc(+environment-friendly!)18:30
doctormo:-D18:30
tedHaha, yeah, that's the reason!18:30
TavWe also talked about paying for a pizza for each participant.18:30
McTav is a few kilometers away if he's not in the US
yes!
18:30
TavI'll almost certainly be going to Boston in January but don't know when.18:31
tedYes, we've done that at work for team building events. I think what works best is something like an Uber Eats gift card.
But I think that's a good idea.  A shared meal, is always a good thing.
Boston in January... not for the weather 🀣
18:31
doctormoFor the Skiing18:32
TavDownhill!18:32
Mcsunny days and -20Β°C18:32
tedOkay, seems like it is an idea that needs tracking right now but doesn't have actions associated with it yet.
Is @ryangorley here to chat about Vectors stuff?
18:33
TavWe need someone to manage the event. We talked about paying if necessary as running on-line events could be a lot of work.18:34
tedHmm, okay, I wasn't invisioning something large enough to need a lot of management. Was thinking more hackfest. Open to hear what people are thinking through.
s/through/though/
Seeing no Ryan, @doctormo do you have anything on the infrastructure agenda?
Noticed the office instance is getting used for forms.
18:36
doctormoFor a general schedule, no structure, I think it should be possible to put together quickly. Although the last online hackfest had a lot more things, so it took more work.18:37
tedWell, Nextcloud, called office. Not Office capital.18:37
doctormooffice.inkscape.org is working well, people are starting to use it.18:37
Mcnice
(tell me if there are issues!)
18:38
tedCool, any luck on a password manager?18:38
doctormohttps://inkscape.org/*membership/ has three new members, Chris, Maren and Sushant. I'm monitoring it closely.18:38
doctormoNo update on password manager, it's a bust, there's very few options that fit the criteria for what we do.18:39
tedUhg, so are just gonna keep doing the GPG thing? That's not beautiful.18:40
doctormoFor now, it's hideous. open to suggestions.18:40
tedDoes it make sense to use a non-OSS one then? Would Lastpass or something work?
Not my first choice, but if there isn't an OSS solution...
18:40
Mcmeh
(@non-OSS)
18:41
doctormoI'm not open to running that myself, but I wouldn't oppose someone else stepping in to put it together.18:41
RdHThere's also a password manager that integrates with our office.inkscape.org, I forgot to ask if that has ever been investigated18:41
doctormo@RdH I don't think we've investigated that.18:42
ted@doctormo, is there a list of requirements somewhere?18:42
RdHI'll look for a link.18:42
ponoI've had some luck with Bitwarden https://bitwarden.com/ and pass https://www.passwordstore.org/18:42
scislac[m]What was the issue with Bitwarden?18:43
doctormoBitWarden doesn't allow sharing of passwords, unless you buy the proprietary enterprise version.18:44
doctormoMakes it sort of pointless.18:44
scislac[m]Ahhhh18:44
tedEh, bother. But that would be better than an all proprietary solution.18:45
doctormoSo the goal isn't to provide contributors with a way to store their own passwords, the goal is: store and group manage access to shared passwords.18:45
Mcwe can try the nextcloud app
( https://apps.nextcloud.com/apps/passwords )
18:45
doctormoMc: Lets!18:45
RdHThat might be the thing that I was talking about18:46
Mcit looks good
@doctormo I shared a password with you
18:46
doctormoWorks, thanks Mc18:47
doctormoOK problem solved.18:47
doctormoAlso, awesome XKCD reference18:47
Mchah, it's fun, it shows \18:47
tedHeh, making the password FranceCanBeatBritanInFootball was clever.18:47
Mcthere must be a search in a breached password database18:48
doctormoThanks @RdH  for the ref, I think we can play with this and see if it does the job.18:48
tedCool, do we have any other infrastructure needs? Seems like we're doing well with the current hosting and VMs.
Does that have a time limit?
(or dollar amount, or whatever)
18:49
Mcnope18:50
tedK, not gonna complain πŸ˜ƒ18:50
Mcall our current sponsors seem to be in a \18:50
tedOkay, that was the last thing in the agenda, we've got 10 minutes. Anyone have anything additional?18:51
RdHAt some point I might bring up macOS hardware (ARM) again... while Windell has provided me with the opportunity to build, I haven't gotten a working version of Inkscape yet. And debugging remotely via ssh... nope.\n(But no need to rush.)18:52
doctormotshirt requests are being collected, a list review will happen after 22nd Nov, please fill out the form. A vote for money will happen after the list review.18:53
tedMakes sense. I think that'd be reasonable.
(T-shirts and ARM OSX HW)
18:53
Mcsomeone mentioned, like, today, a question about ARM windows hw18:53
tedOh, is MS still doing that? I thought they gave up.18:54
Mcafaik windows arm runs 32b win executables without issues but it's a translation, like rosetta thing18:54
tedI'll mention Inkscape runs well on the RPi 4 under Linux πŸ˜‰18:54
doctormoWe're getting very close to request the funding for the paid macOS speed problem. @RdH do you have any update on that?18:55
Mcted: iirc samsung does it with a snapdragon 8x (arm) chip18:55
tedMc: I thought they had a \18:56
Mcyup18:57
doctormoted: That's a very Gtk centric solution.18:58
Mcas long as it works…18:58
doctormoWe're nowhere near a Gtk4 transition, we have Gtk3 problems that are *very serious* today. We could quit macOS releases for a few years, but we should consider fixing the issue in Gtk3.18:59
RdHOr you're already at the main dilemma.18:59
tedI'm not familiar, but I thought GTK3 to 4 was mostly about some deprecated APIs. How many of those do we use?18:59
RdHTav has been investigating, it's a lot19:00
doctormoIt's not a small transition for us.19:00
RdHLike toolbars and stuff that will have to be reworked completely19:00
doctormoBut Actions moves us a great deal.19:00
Mcimo we're nearer to the gtk4 transition because we have a kind of idea of what has to be done, while I'd have no idea what is needed to make gtk3 fast for macOS if it appears that it's \19:01
RdHShould we schedule a dedicated BBB meeting talking about that dilemma?19:01
Mcwe could invite a gtk dev19:01
doctormoI'd be interested to attend RdH, let me know if you need help getting a BBB link or cal set up.19:02
tedI guess my comment would be is that we need some analysis on the two paths first. A meeting doesn't result in increased understanding of the problem.19:03
RdHIt's an important decision about the direction we take, I think as many core developers should be present as possible19:03
TavSorry, I had to play chauffeur. The GTK4 transition will be a ton of work.19:03
Mc( ted: @re:arm, it was https://www.samsung.com/global/galaxy/galaxy-book-s/specs/ )19:03
rere19:03
RdHIt won't be a technical discussion IMHO19:03
Mcit might be easier to contract red hat to help us migrate :D19:04
RdHThey can be contracted?19:04
Mc\19:04
RdH:)19:04
Mcit's a company19:04
tedMc: interesting, wonder what the sales are like.
IBM has plenty of consultants.
19:05
RdHSince no volunteer showed up - a few people said \19:05
Mcpono: is such a thing even possible ? (asking red hat if it's possible to pay their gtk experts to help us migrate to gtk4)19:06
tedI imagine someone like Igalia would be more willing to take such a contract.19:06
TavGtk4 has some great features but it also has some major shortcoming that we'll need to workaround. I'm dealing with one now (tooltips or status bar updates for menu items).19:06
TavI've solved the no icons in menus problem. Each of these things takes days to figure out.19:07
ponoI don't have much experience dealing with Red Hat but can look into it.
Igalia was the group that game to mind for me as well
19:07
tedK, something that needs further investigation.19:09
Mcin france we also have linagora19:09
pono\u0001ACTION will check with Karen and get back to you\u000119:10
Mcbut afaik the main gtk people are at red hat19:10
tedYes, GTK has always been RH's library.
But the other folks have been contracting GTK apps for a while.
I think we're done with what we'll get done in this meeting today.
A couple of exciting things to look into.
Go ahead and tag ==== END OF MEETING ==== though
Folks are welcome to keep chatting of course.
Thank you everyone!
19:11
doctormothis rocket does not stop.19:13
Mc:rocket:19:14
ponocheers :)19:14
doctormoThanks for coming pono19:20

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